Help!! Car won't run.. Please Read.

[Brutal87]

OK.. I just installed the following.
- Edel. 75mm throttle body (took off 70mm BBK)
- C&L 80mm MAF (cal. 42#) (took off 73mm C&L, cal. 19#)
- Ford 42lb Injectors (took off 19#ers)
- Areomotive Fuel Pressure Regulator (took off the Kirban)

Heres the rest of the engine

- Trick Flow Track Heat Camshaft
- E7TE Power Heads
- Vortech V1 S-Trim (Bypass Valve on the way)
- 3.33 Blower Pulley (2.50 on the way)
- No Smog / No Cats
- BBK Shorties, Off Road X-Pipe, Am. Thunder Cat-Back
- 255 In Tank
- Anderson Motorsports, Split Ported Cobra intake (Upper & Lower)

The car ran fine before I installed the stuff at the top. I pulled off the vac line & set the fuel perssure at 45ish. (its at 40 with the line on) The timing was set (with the plug out) at 15. I removed the Vortech FMU (I was told I no longer need it).

OK.. So when I start the car it lopes like a mother & dies.. It will not stay running. I tired less/more fuel & less/more timing. ???

Please give me some ideas..

Thanks,
Carl

[Ponygirl]

I know a particular 93 Cobra that did that. He'll be on in a little while and can tell you how he fixed it. Italian can tell you too.

[Brutal87]

I know a particular 93 Cobra that did that. He'll be on in a little while and can tell you how he fixed it. Italian can tell you too.

Thanks Ponygirl.. :)

[Italian LX]

I'm suprised it started at all. Your fuel start-up tables should've flooded the motor with those 42# injectors. I'm guessing you had to crack the throttle a good bit to get it to start.

I hate to tell you this, but you're to the point that you're going to need some tuning software...

Is this a blow-thru or draw thru set-up?

[Brutal87]

I'm suprised it started at all. Your fuel start-up tables should've flooded the motor with those 42# injectors. I'm guessing you had to crack the throttle a good bit to get it to start.

I hate to tell you this, but you're to the point that you're going to need some tuning software...

Is this a blow-thru or draw thru set-up?

What about going to 36#ers? Would 24# even be enough with running a 2.50 pulley?

[QWKSNKE]

for starters turn the fuel press down. Its to high for your current idle setup. Are you smelling a lot of fuel (as in flooding out)

42's can be a pain in the a** to work with. Odd's are the fuel startup tables are still dumping to much fuel.

Like Italian said, its probably time for a custom tune. Or you could try a different MAF such as Pro-M.

I'll also ask. Is the MAF setup as draw through or blow through?

[Brutal87]

I'll also ask. Is the MAF setup as draw through or blow through?

I'm not sure. Whats the difference? It's a C&L 80mm with the stock electronics on top.

If I put the fuel down to 30.. What should I set the timing at?

[QWKSNKE]

Is the MAF located upstream or downstream of the blower

[Brutal87]

Is the MAF located upstream or downstream of the blower

Up.. in the stock location. :)

[qkjuicedpony]

what are you using to tune this car with?do you have a tweecer or anything like that or a chip of some sort?

[QWKSNKE]

I say try the fuel press around 38psi vacuum off first. Unless you have a BTM on the car, you cannot run base timing at 15 degrees. Do we know the actual boost for the current setup?

[Brutal87]

what are you using to tune this car with?do you have a tweecer or anything like that or a chip of some sort?

I have nothing to tune it.. :(

[Brutal87]

I say try the fuel press around 38psi vacuum off first. Unless you have a BTM on the car, you cannot run base timing at 15 degrees. Do we know the actual boost for the current setup?

The guy told me it was 6/7psi. (3.33 pulley) He didn't have a gauge on it. I just installed the gauge but the car wont run to check... :D BTW.. I have a 10 rib 2.50 pulley to put on yet..


Whats a BTM??

[qkjuicedpony]

I have nothing to tune it.. :(


you can adjust that car with timing and fuel pressure adjustments.i would set the fuel to about 40psi and 10 degrees of timing.just as a start to see what it does.

[Brutal87]

you can adjust that car with timing and fuel pressure adjustments.i would set the fuel to about 40psi and 10 degrees of timing.just as a start to see what it does.

I set it at 40psi & 10 deg. timing.. It will run for a few sec. & then lope bad untill it dies..

Can't I just install smaller injectors & M/A tube but keep the 75mm t/b & 80mm m/a??

[Italian LX]

The guy told me it was 6/7psi. (3.33 pulley) He didn't have a gauge on it. I just installed the gauge but the car wont run to check... :D
You won't be able to check your boost level until you have the car fully tuned and can do a WOT pull to the redline. Until then, all you can do is derive an estimate from pulley size and current engine mods.

Whats a BTM??
It's an ignition module that allows you to agjust timing retard for givien boost levels.

[Italian LX]

Can't I just install smaller injectors & M/A tube but keep the 75mm t/b & 80mm m/a??
The throttle body is not your problem; however, you were fine with the 70mm you already had -- you not at a level to need that big of a TB yet (and you won't be until you go to an after market block).

I would ditch the C&L and get a Pro-M Univer.

[86GT]

I did not read anywhere that you changed the MAF curve in the tuner just that you installed an 80mm cal'd for 42's. Do you have a WB? There is also the injector offset vs battery voltage that needs to be adjusted.

With your setup you can either put the stock MAF curve in or put the C&L curve in. Its my opinion to use the stock curve just to see if it cures the problem. Then put the C&L curve in and fine tune that.

The rest has already been said, set timing to 10 and the fuel pressure to 38-39 with vacuum off.

[Brutal87]

The throttle body is not your problem; however, you were fine with the 70mm you already had -- you not at a level to need that big of a TB yet (and you won't be until you go to an after market block).

I would ditch the C&L and get a Pro-M Univer.

I can't ditch it yet.. I just bought it. :D

Would you suggest putting in 24lb or 36lb'ers to get it runnin? I would think if I just downsized the injectors.. It would run fine?? right??

[Brutal87]

I did not read anywhere that you changed the MAF curve in the tuner just that you installed an 80mm cal'd for 42's. Do you have a WB? There is also the injector offset vs battery voltage that needs to be adjusted.


Your right.. I just installed the MAF.. Thats it.. Whats a "WB" & how do I adjust the injector offset vs battery voltage ??

Thnaks :)

[86GT]

WB is wide band oxygen sensor. It is an aftermarket O2 sensor that is much more accurate than the stock units. If you had to ask then most likley you do not have one installed.

As for the offsets try the factory curve first

[Brutal87]

As for the offsets try the factory curve first

How do I do this? I've never had to tune a Mustang before.. :(

[qkjuicedpony]

there is no need to change the injectors.it just needs a little tuning and it will run a lot better once tuned with the 42's and no FMU.just adjust it and work with it.you will figure it out.

[Italian LX]

I did not read anywhere that you changed the MAF curve in the tuner just that you installed an 80mm cal'd for 42's. Do you have a WB? There is also the injector offset vs battery voltage that needs to be adjusted.

With your setup you can either put the stock MAF curve in or put the C&L curve in. Its my opinion to use the stock curve just to see if it cures the problem. Then put the C&L curve in and fine tune that.
Hey Clint, he doesn't have a tuner, so he can't change anything.

[Italian LX]

How do I do this? I've never had to tune a Mustang before.. :(
You can only change this stuff if you get some tuning software and programmer such as a TwEECer.

[QWKSNKE]

I would be willing to bet your fuel press will be around 34 or so vacuum off before you get it to run right

[86GT]

No tuner. Oh that tells me alot. Sorry about that. I would agree with QWKSNKE that the Fuel pressure is the cause then. The pressure should be set to 39 with vacuum off. it will be something like 34 with the vacuum on depending on how much vacuum your cam produces.

The general rule is 2 inches of vacuum is 1psi on the fuel pressure guage. A 14" vacuum will change the fuel pressure by 7psi. Take the original fuel pressure and subtract the 7psi to get 32psi.

[Brutal87]

Thanks for thr help guys.. :chug:

I'm going to try to get it to run so I can bring it to Sutton Ford. They are a SCT dealer.. They can tune it for me.. ;)