Explorer 302 motor question...

[88 Sleeper Coupe]

Just thought I'd ask a question here. I'm new to the forums so maybe you can help me out with this. If people like to run(GT40 or GT40P?) heads from the explorer AND the upper and lower intake manifolds from the explorer... whats the bad side of just swapping in an entire explorer motor? They have the good intakes and the gt40 heads and everything. Put forged bottom end internals from a different motor or just build new forged bottom end internals and throw a cam in it and spray the hell outta it.

I guess to wrap it up why don't people try to just buy complete explorer v8 motors to swap in there car instead of just the heads and intake?

Also... how good are those heads as a direct bolt-on replacement for the stock 302 mustang heads? Are they good for a chunk of HP direct bolt on? Or have them ported some first?

Thanks!!

[coupe]

They are a good "budget" head...especially if they're found cheap. But some people think they are worth their weight in gold and nothing could be farther from the truth...About $300-$350 is a good price IMO.

Some people DO buy the complete Explorer motors. There's a sensor missing in the lower intake you have to add for a mustang, and the oil-pan, pickup, and front cover are different (Summit or a donor mustang would have the kit). Other than that, it is a good alternative to the standard HO motor. Add a B303 cam and it's off to the races! :nice:

[QWKSNKE]

They are a good "budget" head...especially if they're found cheap. But some people think they are worth their weight in gold and nothing could be farther from the truth...About $300-$350 is a good price IMO.

Some people DO buy the complete Explorer motors. There's a sensor missing in the lower intake you have to add for a mustang, and the oil-pan, pickup, and front cover are different (Summit or a donor mustang would have the kit). Other than that, it is a good alternative to the standard HO motor. Add a B303 cam and it's off to the races! :nice:

+1

Another reason people buy just the heads or intake is because that is all they need. Why replace a motor fo an 'ok' head swap.

[88 Sleeper Coupe]

What can you expect to gain by going to explorer heads over the stock GT heads?

Same with the intake.. if you got the explorer upper and lower and a set of GT40 heads what kinda HP can you gain? My motor currently has a .40 over bore with hyper bottom end and a b303 cam and comp cam valves springs on the stock heads. I haven't had a chance to run it in the 1/8th with the new rear end... (fully rebuilt 8.8 fully shimmed with 3.55 gear and x2c upper and lower control arms) and my weld skinnies and slicks but with slicks (Which didn't help in this case at all) with a factory 2.73 gear it ran 9.0 and 78 in the 1/8th. I'm shooting for 8.7's now with the new rear-end setup and a little more weight reduction maybe 8.6's.

I know you can't play the math game im not trying to find up what it'll pickup in the 1/8th with those heads and intake but an esimate in HP.

Also.. are those heads a direct bolt-on and go upgrade or should you invest in having them ported any before bolting them up?

P.S. Thanks for the nice input. Some forums you ask questions and people are straight up assholes. I'm wanting weight and a budget build to get this car into the 8.5's on motor before spray and im startng to push the limits of my wallet. I was shooting for 8.5's on motor for under $3500 including the $2000 i paid for the car :)

[coupe]

I was shooting for 8.5's on motor for under $3500 including the $2000 i paid for the car :)

Set of Aluminum Heads: $1100
Cobra Intake: $300 (just look around)
-----------------------------
Total: $1400

And WAY better than GT40P and Explorer Intake.

Plus a MAF, TB, and some 24# injectors would be nice if you don't already have them... This stuff will go low-mid 8's with that B-303.

[Italian LX]

Set of Aluminum Heads: $1100
Cobra Intake: $300 (just look around)
-----------------------------
Total: $1400

And WAY better than GT40P and Explorer Intake.
I agree with Matt. Since you already have a decent cam, go ahead and fix the other two major weak points (heads and intake) with something nice. You won't be disapointed with the results.

Plus a MAF, TB, and some 24# injectors would be nice if you don't already have them... This stuff will go low-mid 8's with that B-303.
MAF would be the next thing I would get. Throttle body not so necessary (but helpful) and the injectors wouldn't need to be increased until you put down 275+ rwhp. (However, if you have the money, go ahead and upgrade to 24# at the sdame time you upgrade MAF's -- that way you wouldn't have top get your MAF calibrated again.)

[rtusnake]

We have two complete explorer motors at work for $500 each if you want to do the explorer heads

[QWKSNKE]

What can you expect to gain by going to explorer heads over the stock GT heads?



One of my combos in the cobra was the OEM GT-40 irons, OEM cobra intake, b cam and 1.7 rockers

I put down somewhere around 253-255 rwhp with that combo. I would guess with the explorer intake it would be somewhere around 245ish. I couldn't tell you what the 1/8 mile times were because I never look at the 1/8 section of a timeslip. I can tell you that on street tires it was good for around 13.40's in the 1/4

[88 Sleeper Coupe]

rtusnake: Where are you located? You'd want $500 for the entire motor? including upper and lower intake?

As for the other people that responded: I understand completely about aluminum heads and all that but this is a very budget built car. Once I get this car into the 7's in the 1/8th (thats all we have around here) this car is retired. I plan to actually teach the girlfriend to race this car once it hits 7's and spend next year building a 351w motor to put into another car that I want to be in the 7's with on motor.

I think the GT40 heads and upper/lower explorer intake will probably be the route I go with this car. I want to clean this motor up and make it a presentable car thats capable of 7's and still street legal. I guess 7's in the 1/8th on spray put me around high 12's I would think in the 1/4? My buddies built stang runs 6.9's and ran 10.80's in the quarter.

P.S. I know... what am i thinking.. teaching the girlfriend to drive the mustang and race it.. I must want this car wrecked! lol

[coupe]

I still think your money is spent better elsewhere, but if you're gonna spray it, the heads won't matter as much. With the Explorer parts you should expect 8.50's and spray it to 7.70's pretty easlity. That is about 13.50's and 12.0's respectively. Maybe even 11's in the 1/4 on gas.

[QWKSNKE]

I. With the Explorer parts you should expect 8.50's and spray it to 7.70's pretty easlity. .

That better be abig kit for theat much difference in the 1/8

[Italian LX]

That better be abig kit for theat much difference in the 1/8
No shit! :eek:

However, that 250-shot would be fun as hell. . . once. :bomb:

:D

[joker]

My cousins coupe dropped around .8 on a 125 shot. He was having traction issues on the bottle though, I am sure slicks would have knocked another couple of tenths off. His setup was gt40 heads, b cam, street heat intake, through a powerglide. The best time at Bama was low 7's on drag radials.

[coupe]

:werd: Seen similar results too, thus my numbers.

How's 12.99 to 11.77 on a 125 dry kit sound!? :metal:

Automatic Trans might be why Lee & Brian are thinking it's outrageous. :shrug:

[QWKSNKE]

:werd: Seen similar results too, thus my numbers.

How's 12.99 to 11.77 on a 125 dry kit sound!? :metal:

Automatic Trans might be why Lee & Brian are thinking it's outrageous. :shrug:

i believe dropping that much in the 1/4. But that is a drastic drop in the 1/8. On a 150 shot my car dropped around 1.1-1.2 sec in the 1/4. 1/8 was half that which equals out to the right math

[coupe]

Yea, I might have been a little generous. But it would certainly go high 7's. :nice: That's all he's looking for.

[Craig K.]

I agree with the statement Matt (coupe) made earlier, I would try and find a set of aluminum heads and a used cobra (or other) intake.

The 94/95 Cobras were rated at 240 hp (I think 93 was 235) so through in a cam and you may pick up 15-20 hp and be close to those ratings at the wheel.

I would think with a set of after market head, intake, MAF etc... and you should be quite a bite higher, perhaps in the 260-285 range (what do you guys think).

I would save a little, and put you money down one time on good stuff.
Until you have the money, race the heck out of the car and get good at launching it, and leaving the tree.

[Italian LX]

:werd: Seen similar results too, thus my numbers.

How's 12.99 to 11.77 on a 125 dry kit sound!? :metal:
That's typical; my old 302 went from a 12.99 to a 11.69 on a 125-shot wet kit, but like Lee said, you where originally talking about dropping .8 seconds in the eighth... that ain't going to happen on anything less than a 200-shot.


Automatic Trans might be why Lee & Brian are thinking it's outrageous. :shrug:
No, see my above statement. We think it's outrageous because it [i]is[/i[ outrageous! Automatic or stick, you're not going to drop that much 1/8 mile ET on a small kit.

[coupe]

.8 seconds in the eighth... that ain't going to happen on anything less than a 200-shot. Automatic or stick, you're not going to drop that much 1/8 mile ET on a small kit.

200 shot is exaggerating it a little. SLVRBULLIT chime in please. I know he did very well on just a 100-shot before the last round of mods.

I think it just takes you a 200 shot to knock off .8 sec. :poke:

[Blown 5.0]

What about 9.30s off the spray, and 730s on the spray? We have a 351 in a Pinto wagon that will gain exactly 2 whole seconds on a 150 horse shot. This same motor was in a Ranger pickup years ago and would gain exactly the same, These times are 1/8 mile times, he has never ran 1/4 mile, (i don't think he has enough gear).although this is the only time i have ever saw this much gain from such a small shot.

[88 Sleeper Coupe]

I don't it taking more than a 125 shot to go from 8.6's to 7.8's honestly. My buddy has a stock GT 84 body style with t-5 3.73 gear and a 125 shot and runs 7.8's to 8.0's on spray. No cam or anything.. therefore im thinking 7.8's or 7.7's on spray with the GT40 heads and a better intake is very achievable... oh well..

I guess im trying to get you all to see that I'm building this car to actually have a FINISHED project lol.. I want a car that I can consider finished thats reliable, pretty nice looking with a good chassis and wheels/tires/motor to put it into the 7's.

At this point I hope to retire this car and build another one. I want one thats done that I can hop in and go when I feel like going to the local racing scenes and the track.

[Italian LX]

My cousins coupe dropped around .8 on a 125 shot. He was having traction issues on the bottle though, I am sure slicks would have knocked another couple of tenths off. His setup was gt40 heads, b cam, street heat intake, through a powerglide. The best time at Bama was low 7's on drag radials.

200 shot is exaggerating it a little. SLVRBULLIT chime in please. I know he did very well on just a 100-shot before the last round of mods.

I think it just takes you a 200 shot to knock off .8 sec. :poke:I don't it taking more than a 125 shot to go from 8.6's to 7.8's honestly. My buddy has a stock GT 84 body style with t-5 3.73 gear and a 125 shot and runs 7.8's to 8.0's on spray. No cam or anything.. therefore im thinking 7.8's or 7.7's on spray with the GT40 heads and a better intake is very achievable... oh well..

Anyone notice how the people that are arguing against QWKSNKE and I are all talking about their "buddy's" cars and Lee and I are talking about personal experience?

Let's hear someone else that actually runs a nitrous car chime in.

[joker]

Anyone notice how the people that are arguing against QWKSNKE and I are all talking about their "buddy's" cars and Lee and I are talking about personal experience?

Let's hear someone else that actually runs a nitrous car chime in.

I am talking about first hand expierience being that I drove the car down the track on and off of the bottle. I am not talking about heresay, as I was personally there and saw the times that he was runnning with it as well. They may be talking about something they never witnessed or expierienced first hand, but just because it wasnt my car doesnt mean that I am basing what I said off of second hand knowledge. You are just assuming that because the other people's statements here are contrary to your expierience, that they must not be true. I have no reason to lie to anyone here about what I saw, or make anything up.

By the way, MY 96 dropped about .7 in the 1/8th on a 125 shot but was having some clutch issues on the spray.

[Italian LX]

You are just assuming that because the other people's statements here are contrary to your expierience, that they must not be true.
No, I'm basing it off the fact that it's easy to convey wrong information about someone else's car. I sometimes have trouble keeping up with my own numbers let alone 20 other cars that I have seen run.

Hell, I have wrenched on and driven Lee's car and I know more about it than most anyone, but I still have to ask him about old track times, power numbers, etc.

[joker]

No, I'm basing it off the fact that it's easy to convey wrong information about someone else's car. I sometimes have trouble keeping up with my own numbers let alone 20 other cars that I have seen run.

Hell, I have wrenched on and driven Lee's car and I know more about it than most anyone, but I still have to ask him about old track times, power numbers, etc.
Just because it is easy to convey the wrong information doesnt mean that is it wrong though. I am not trying to argue with you, just letting you know that I am positive on the numbers because honesltly that is the fastest car I have driven down a track.

Also if you think about it, nitrous is going to gain you more time in the first 1/8th than it will in the second 1/8th soley because of the fact that you gain so much torque and increased momentum off of the line. In the second 1/8th of a mile the torque isnt really benefiting the car as much because the resistance to movement has already been largely overcome. If you are looking at a gain of 1.2 seconds over the coarse of the 1/4 I would be willing to bet at least .7 of that gain is coming in the first 1/8th mile. No way to test that theory though as someone would have to be really handy with the button to only spray the first 1/8 or second 1/8th.

[coupe]

Anyone notice how the people that are arguing are all talking about their "buddy's" cars?
Let's hear someone else that actually runs a nitrous car chime in.

:rolleyes: Aw c'mon Italian. You know that we all have valuable input on things because of others, even others on this site. I am at the 1/8th mile track almost every week with friends running nitrous, turbo, and sometimes both at a time!

I don't care for Nitrous as a power adder. That doesn't mean I can't add input to this thread about Nitrous. :nice:

And from the consensus here...it looks like some other cars have indeed picked up significantly when you said it was impossible. :poke:

[Italian LX]

:rolleyes: Aw c'mon Italian. You know that we all have valuable input on things because of others, even others on this site. I am at the 1/8th mile track almost every week with friends running nitrous, turbo, and sometimes both at a time!
I never said that second hand information was uselss or unwanted; I was merely interested in what other first-hand users of nitrous would say.

Sorry, I will go back in my corner and be quiet. :(

[QWKSNKE]

Also if you think about it, nitrous is going to gain you more time in the first 1/8th than it will in the second 1/8th soley because of the fact that you gain so much torque and increased momentum off of the line. In the second 1/8th of a mile the torque isnt really benefiting the car as much because the resistance to movement has already been largely overcome.

Wished I could figure how to get my agreement and disagreement with the above from my brain to my fingers so I could put a response in


If you are looking at a gain of 1.2 seconds over the coarse of the 1/4 I would be willing to bet at least .7 of that gain is coming in the first 1/8th mile.

I 98% agree with that statement. While I do agree about the nitrous torque getting you off the line you got to remember that everything you gain is almost doubled when stretching it out to the 1/4 mile. Hell just knocking a tenth off your 60' is worth 2-3 tenths off your 1/4 e.t. on a clean run.

By the way, knocking .7 in the 1/8 in your old 96 is very impressive. Was the nitrous and n/a comparison on your car performed on a good sticky tire?

While I have done it yet, I feel confident my car as it sits now has a 7.95 1/8 12.4 1/4 in it on motor. (best as of this week is 8.00 and 12.50) I am interested to see what kind of times I get on motor and on a 150 shot this weekend at track day.

[joker]

I 98% agree with that statement. While I do agree about the nitrous torque getting you off the line you got to remember that everything you gain is almost doubled when stretching it out to the 1/4 mile. Hell just knocking a tenth off your 60' is worth 2-3 tenths off your 1/4 e.t. on a clean run. Yes, but what does lowering your 60' knock off of your 1/8th mile time? What is to say that 2 to 3 tenths you are gaining in the 1/4 isnt gained in the first 1/8th? Even if you could run test srpaying in only the respective 1/8 mile halves your results would still not be dead on accurate because as we all know in drag racing there are TOO many variables to duplicate the other factors exactly every time. [/QUOTE]

By the way, knocking .7 in the 1/8 in your old 96 is very impressive. Was the nitrous and n/a comparison on your car performed on a good sticky tire? Thank you. Yes, it was N/A compression. Mods done were prochamber, mufflers, 4.10 gears, pullies, and a 125 wet kit. It was done on ET streets right after they ran the bracket races at Bama and before the import crowd pulled up all the vht, so the track was good and sticky as well.

While I have done it yet, I feel confident my car as it sits now has a 7.95 1/8 12.4 1/4 in it on motor. (best as of this week is 8.00 and 12.50) I am interested to see what kind of times I get on motor and on a 150 shot this weekend at track day. It will be intersting to see. I wouldnt be too suprised to see a 7.0 to 7.2 in the 1/8th though. Since the track should be hooking much better than Steele I think you will see some really nice gains, even in the 1/8th.

[QWKSNKE]

.

It will be intersting to see. I wouldnt be too suprised to see a 7.0 to 7.2 in the 1/8th though. Since the track should be hooking much better than Steele I think you will see some really nice gains, even in the 1/8th.

I also have 4.10's now so they help with the juiced run

[joker]

I also have 4.10's now so they help with the juiced run
:nice: I hope you get some nice times out of it.